[Histonet] Re:peggy wenk comments on HT/HTL practical - To stick a Pin

Wed Aug 31 16:11:03 CDT 2011

Just to let you know, I don't let new techs near prostate, liver or any other kind of needle biopsy for at least a year. Why put them under that kind of pressure? I want them to stay in the field. I figure working for me is torture enough. We give new techs up to three years to get up to speed and pass the exam. 

Tom Podawiltz, HT (ASCP)
Histology Section Head/Laboratory Safety Officer
LRGHealthcare
603-524-3211 ext: 3220
________________________________________
From: Matthew Lunetta [MLunetta <@t> luhcares.org]
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 1:29 PM
To: joelleweaver <@t> hotmail.com; histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu; Podawiltz, Thomas; b-frederick <@t> northwestern.edu; hborgeri <@t> wakehealth.edu; rjbuesa <@t> yahoo.com
Subject: RE: [Histonet] Re:peggy wenk comments on HT/HTL practical - To stick a Pin

Tom,

I feel that this is very important conversation, not whining about the situation but shining a very bright light on an important subject. I agree that it is an opportunity to help shape a new HT if several factors are in place, the facility can afford the time, cost and personnel that it takes to train.

Oh by and by the new HT is coming along and it will take months (much longer than the 3 probationary) to get them to the right place, luckily we can afford (just barley) the time, cost and personnel. At this time 2 months into the process they are not cutting small BX, STATS, embedding of BX, no immuno work and are not to be left alone in the lab. We are hopeful for a good outcome.

Matt Lunetta BS HT (ASCP)

>>> "Podawiltz, Thomas" <tpodawiltz <@t> lrgh.org> 08/31/11 8:59 AM >>>
I have had one tech finish an online HT course and currently a second person looking at going the online route to her HT. In both cases as their supervisor I have had to sign on as their in house trainer. As a trainer it is my job to make sure that they know how to function well in Histology when they are finished.

My first tech was working elsewhere when she started school and receive little support with her studies, one of the main reasons she came to work for me was how appalled I was to hear that she was getting not support. By the time she was finished I would of let her work on any specimen removed from either myself or anyone in my family.

We get the HT's that we work to get. As a supervisor and trainer, I am only as good as my staff makes me look. If I can go on vacation and the lab does not miss a beat, then I have done my job correctly.

So to everyone that gets a fresh tech who got short changed on their training, don't whine about it, take it as an opportunity to shape them to the HT that you need them to be.

Tom Podawiltz HT (ASCP)
Histology Section Head/Laboratory Safety Officer.
LRGHealthcare
Laconia, NH 03246
603-524-3211 ext: 3220

-----Original Message-----
From: histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu [mailto:histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu] On Behalf Of Matthew Lunetta
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 10:15 AM
To: histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
Subject: RE: [Histonet] Re:peggy wenk comments on HT/HTL practical - To stick a Pin

You might be surprised I too agree with Joyce and Richard.

I understand very well that a new graduate will not be up to the skill
level of an individual that has been working for a while. What I am
surprised about is that this program seemed to teach to pass the test
and has left all of the technical skills left to be taught by the
persons 1st job. This could lead to several painful experiences for not
only the facility but the new HT.

Were is the disconnect. If a person is doing the OJT route they need to
have at least one year of experience signed-off by a pathologist. If a
person goes through a program who is responsible for making sure that
the base-skills are there? Is there not some standards that a new
graduate should be able to cut/embed so many blocks in an hour? Is it
reasonable for a new graduate to take 1.5 hours to cut 5 (uterus,
appendix, tonsil) one-cuts? From facing to lifting the slide off the
water-bath? Or to take 2hrs to embed 15 (large tissue sections) one-cut
blocks?

So Richard is also right how is a new grad to get experiance without
that 1st gig? But how much resposiblity should be placed on the 1st gig
to train a new HT that is supose to have base skills in lab equipment,
cutting, embeding, staining etal?

More thoughts....
ciao
Matt Lunetta BS HT(ASCP)

Edwards, Richard E." ree3 <@t> leicester.ac.uk

If you do not employ recently trained individuals, how on earth are they
going to obtain the experience that Matt craves, it's beyond me. My
daughter recently qualified as an Occupational Therapist, when she asked
for the reason that she was unsuccessful in obtaining a post, they said
that as a recently graduated student she had no experience, what
rubbish!!.Thankfully she has now obtained a position under more
enlightened management that is to be found here!.

Cheers

Richard Edwards
>>> "Shirley A. Powell" 08/30/11 6:32 PM >>>
I second that Joyce.
sp

________________________________________
From: histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
[histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu] On Behalf Of Weems, Joyce
[JWeems <@t> sjha.org]
Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2011 6:17 PM
To: Matthew Lunetta; histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
Subject: RE: [Histonet] Re:peggy wenk comments on HT/HTL practical - To
stick a Pin

I don't understand how a student of any program would have not a portion
of their program dedicated to these skills. We partner with Darton
College and their students to do a certain number of hours for their
"Clinicals". They know how to do those things, are trained by the
clinical coordinator for the program, and are graded on their work.

Are they prepared to go into a lab and work like they've done OJT for
1-2 years? Not at all, but they need to be hired with the understanding
that they will need time and patience to develop their speed and their
skill.

My 2 cents...

Joyce Weems
Pathology Manager
Saint Joseph's Hospital
5665 Peachtree Dunwoody Rd NE
Atlanta, GA 30342
678-843-7376 - Phone
678-843-7831 - Fax

-----Original Message-----
From: histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
[mailto:histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu] On Behalf Of Matthew
Lunetta
Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2011 13:59
To: histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
Subject: [Histonet] Re:peggy wenk comments on HT/HTL practical - To
stick a Pin

Hey all,

I found Peggy's comments on why the practical was discontinued to be
very interesting. Of late I have had some experience with a new HT that
graduated from a program and passed the current HT exam.
So, as they say in Great Britain, to stick a pin in the ASCP reasons.

This new fresh and shiny HT has all the book knowledge we needed them to
have. What they did not have was any technical skills.
1) never used a microscope or centrifuge.
2) no special staining experience
3) no embedding experience
4) no cutting experience

When they cut or embed they are no were near the speed, accuracy or
quality that is nee
ded in our industry. While they can answer any
question you ask them they just do not have the technical skills one
would expect from a new graduate.

I have learned several lessons from this experience.

1) I am so very glad I was one of the last HT's to have taken the
practical
2) Any new HT's will be taking a practical if I am involved in the
selection process.
3) I will question they quality of any new HT from this particular
program

While I am sure that there are many new HT's that do have the skills
needed, this one experience has caused me to be more cautious.

Respectfully,

Matt Lunetta
BS, HT (ASCP)

Message: 2
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2011 18:09:46 +0200
From: "Gudrun Lang"
Subject: AW: [Histonet] Re: peggy wenk comments on HT/HTL practical
To: "'Bob Richmond'"
Cc: histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
Message-ID: <8B7976B131854ABC8DB236FAB5026851 <@t> dielangs.at>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

Dear Dr. Richmond
Here in Austria we have a job open for a pathologist with 5 years
experience. ;)
Please, think it over to come. Lovely mountains, lovely techs...

It sounds, like you are from that sort of pathologist techs dream of.
Gudrun

-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
Von: histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
[mailto:histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu] Im Auftrag von Bob
Richmond
Gesendet: Dienstag, 30. August 2011 04:43
An: histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
Betreff: [Histonet] Re: peggy wenk comments on HT/HTL practical

I really appreciate Peggy Wenk's analysis of the practical examination
and why it had to be dropped. I never really understood the issue
before.

I must confess I always enjoyed helping the prospective examinee
obtain exactly the right tissue.

"No, this endometrium is poorly preserved. We'll arrange with surgery
for a completely fresh specimen - I'll block it initially for the
diagnosis, then we'll fix it overnight and then block it exactly to
specifications. - Ick - this one's been curetted - we'll get another
one".

"I'll block the margins of this colon resection specimen, then we'll
pin a portion of tissue onto paraffin and fix it flat overnight."

"Next time I do an autopsy we'll get a lumbar spinal cord in the
intact dura. I'll open the dura dorsally and ventrally with iridectomy
scissors, then we'll hang it in neutral buffered formalin for two
days. Then I'll tie the dura and dependent nerves with a cotton
string. When you embed you'll remove the string, taking care that dura
and nerves remain in position. After that it's all yours. If it
doesn't work the first time, we've got three more levels in the jar."

OK, I'm a geek, I'm 72 years old, I got a right.

Bob Richmond
Samurai Pathologist
Knoxville TN

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