[Histonet] RE: testing cutting ability--This is starting to ReallyAnnoy me.

Mon Feb 23 19:33:28 CST 2009

I'll never tell

-----Original Message-----
From: Rittman, Barry R [mailto:Barry.R.Rittman <@t> uth.tmc.edu] 
Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 6:32 PM
To: JoeNocito; 'Peter Carroll'
Cc: histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
Subject: RE: [Histonet] RE: testing cutting ability--This is starting to
ReallyAnnoy me.

Joe
how many previous lives did you have, and what were you in each of them?

I think that it is a great idea to have individuals cutting some test
blocks.
While it is true that you can fire individuals within their probationary
period, the pressure from administration in many cases is not to do so and
you have wasated time trying to train them to the position. It is also a
very expensive proposition both in time and financially to advertise
positions and interview for these positions. 
You certainly cannot determine an individuals expertise by their resume or
even by certification.
After all what does 20 years experience denote? It can be a fruitfull 20
years with varied experiences or one year repeated 20 times. I would opt for
the individual who has 20 years varied experience.
Let the applicants cut some blocks, with the due consideration that
interviewing is stressful for them as well as for the interviewer.
Barry

________________________________________
From: histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
[histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu] On Behalf Of JoeNocito
[jnocito <@t> satx.rr.com]
Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 6:16 PM
To: 'Peter Carroll'
Cc: histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
Subject: RE: [Histonet] RE: testing cutting ability--This is starting   to
ReallyAnnoy me.

In a previous life, I went on a two week vacation. When I came back, I had
two new techs that I never had a chance to interview. They were hired in my
absence (that's why it's a previous life). They couldn't cut, embed or do
special stains. Being a clinical training site, I proceeded to teach these
"experienced" techs just like I taught my students. I was furious at the
powers at be because of this situation. These people couldn't handle it and
both quit with in a year. When I started interviewing for those positions, I
gave each applicant a 20 question exam and gave them 5 blocks to cut. I
needed to have an objective way to choose the best candidate so I would not
have any repercussions or accusations that I hired one over the other
because one had longer hair or a prettier smile or because I had something
against some one. The lab was getting busier by the day and I just couldn't
afford to teach "experienced" techs from scratch. Just my four cents worth
(inflation is a killer).

-----Original Message-----
From: histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
[mailto:histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu] On Behalf Of Peter
Carroll
Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 3:26 PM
Cc: histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
Subject: Re: [Histonet] RE: testing cutting ability--This is starting to
ReallyAnnoy me.

 > Jeez, are clinical histopath labs just sweat-shops?

Pretty much. Having spent years doing path at a huge local hospital
which featured a slave-driving lab director who was less qualified to
run the lab than half the people working in it, I must say that I agree
with this observation.

At the same time, as much as I enjoy my more laid-back research path
position now, I'd get fired in a heartbeat if I produced only one block
every 30 minutes. Actually, I just got finished doing closer to 40 in
the last hour, and today was a fairly slow day (yet not at all on par
with the old clinical stats, were 8-12 techs embedded/sectioned closer
to 800-1000 blocks per shift).

Charles.Embrey wrote:
> Jerry, you are right that clinical work is different from research.  You
are wrong to consider 20 blocks per hour to be a "sweat-shop" pace. I've
know scores of histotechs that cut well over 20 blocks per hour and produce
high quality slides. Sorry you feel offended by this discussion but there is
a real world outside of your university walls.
> Chuck
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
[mailto:histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu] On Behalf Of JR R
> Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 1:58 PM
> To: histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
> Subject: [Histonet] RE: testing cutting ability--This is starting to
ReallyAnnoy me.
>
>
> All this talk of having people actually section as part of the interview
process is offensive to me.
>
> I have hired and trained lots of histotechnologists.  Mostly I train them
myself, from scratch, but sometimes I hire them pre-trained.  Then of
course, I re-train them anyway so they can do the work to the specs of my
lab.  Any deficiencies they have will be corrected through training.  By me.
>
> At my University there is a formal 30 day (maybe it's longer, I can't
recall) probationary period for new hires.   That's good enough.  Why in the
world would I need to have them section as part of an interview process?
>
> I am also offended by the "blocks per hour" language.  Partly it's because
in my lab we do exhaustive serial sectioning, so I consider a tech who gives
me one block every half-hour to be doing a good job.
>
> Maybe it's different in clinical work, but...20 blocks per hour?  And you
expect quality work?
>
> Jeez, are clinical histopath labs just sweat-shops?
>
> It's no wonder histopathologists feel overworked and underappreciated.
>
> Jerry Ricks
> Research Scientist
> University of Washington
> Department of Pathology
>
>
>
>
>
>
>> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 10:14:06 -0500
>> From: trathborne <@t> somerset-healthcare.com
>> To: rjbuesa <@t> yahoo.com; histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu;
tbraud <@t> holyredeemer.com
>> Subject: RE: [Histonet] RE: testing cutting ability during an interview
>> CC:
>>
>> We also have the staff talk to the applicant during this process. It
gives you a good idea if the person can talk and cut at the same time. The
last thing anyone wants is a histotech that has to stop sectioning during a
conversation!
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
>> [mailto:histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu]On Behalf Of Rene J
>> Buesa
>> Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 10:05 AM
>> To: histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu; Terri Braud
>> Subject: Re: [Histonet] RE: testing cutting ability during an interview
>>
>>
>> I for one always required any applicant to prepare 20 slides stained with
H&E. I can assure that I selected "difficult" blocks to cut and the
applicant was required to sign a disclaimer that included that s/he he knew
how to section and avoid injuries.

>> The whole process was timed (to get a first idea about productivity) and
I evaluated and graded the slides at the end.
>> The results were used as one of the elements to decide about offering the
position (the fundamental) but I waited until all the applicants had
completed the tests so sometimes the applicant had to be contacted a few
days later to let him/her know about the results.
>> René J.
>>
>> --- On Mon, 2/23/09, Terri Braud <tbraud <@t> holyredeemer.com> wrote:
>>
>> From: Terri Braud <tbraud <@t> holyredeemer.com>
>> Subject: [Histonet] RE: testing cutting ability during an interview
>> To: histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
>> Date: Monday, February 23, 2009, 8:57 AM
>>
>> >From a recent digest:
>> <If you want to know if someone you are interviewing can really section
or
>> stain, set them down at a microtome during the interview process, and
watch
>> them.>
>>
>> I have a question about the following statement plucked from a recent
digest.
>> What are the legal ramifications if a person cuts themselves during an
>> interview?
>> We've had this discussion at my place of employment and came to the
>> decision that it would leave us open to a legal liability.
>> I would love to hear some discussion on this subject, as well as any
>> experiences that others have had.
>> Terri
>>
>> Terri L. Braud, HT(ASCP)
>> Anatomic Pathology Supervisor
>> Laboratory
>> Holy Redeemer Hospital and Medical Center
>>
>>
>>
>>
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