[Histonet] mouse perfusion rate

Mon Mar 29 13:26:58 CDT 2010

I have perfused mice and rats at 300 mm Hg, about double physiological
level, don't know what that made the flow rate.  All mammals have the
same blood pressure (within tolerances), so it is easier to select a
suitable pressure to use than a flow rate, which varies dramatically.  

I look at brain, never pay any attention to the gut.  Clear fluid comes
out the nose, that is a good sign.  There are pressure release valves
across the cribiform plate to release CSF if there is too much.  I am
flooding the system, fluid coming out the nose means the extracellular
fluid and CSF is being replaced as well as vascular blood.  Good.  

The tissue is quality is excellent, free of red blood cells, can be
unshrunk depending on the tonicity (should be sub isotonic) of the
fixative fluid.  Have looked at Nissl and EM material, no evidence of
damage to the tissue.

If gut is extended, might have something to do with the large intestines
job of removing fluid from feces, and flooding the system swells the
tissue.  But does it matter?  Do you use that tissue?  What is the
tissue quality if you use it after physiological pressure perfusion.

Cordially,

Charles W. Scouten, Ph.D

Product Manager, MNL

Biosystems Division

Leica Biosystems Richmond, Inc.
5205 Route 12
P.O. Box 528
Richmond, IL 60071
United States of America

Telephone 630 964 0501

facsimile +1 630 964 0576

www.MyNeuroLab.com <http://www.myneurolab.com/> 

www.leica-microsystems.com <http://www.leica-microsystems.com/> 

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From: Merced M Leiker <leiker <@t> buffalo.edu> [mailto:Merced M Leiker
<leiker <@t> buffalo.edu>] 
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 9:05 AM
To: Joseph Saby <saby_joseph_a <@t> yahoo.com>;
Charles.Scouten <@t> leica-microsystems.com; making <@t> ufl.edu;
histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
Subject: Re: [Histonet] mouse perfusion rate

Hi Joe, 

Thanks for that notice about flow rates. But I think for the mouse you 
meant 1-3mls/min (not per 10min?)... 

Regards, 
Merced 

--On Saturday, March 27, 2010 5:03 PM -0700 Joseph Saby 
< saby_joseph_a <@t> yahoo.com> wrote: 

> 
> 
> All- 
> 
> From previous work with rat perfusions, the flow rate was about 10 
> ml/minute. If I had to guess, the equivalent flow rate for a mouse
would 
> be closer to 1-3 mls/10 minutes. If you go 10 ml/minute, you will 
> definitely cause blowout artefacts. 
> 
> Joe Saby, BA HT 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __________________________________________________ 
> From: Merced M Leiker < leiker <@t> buffalo.edu> 
> To: Charles.Scouten <@t> leica-microsystems.com; making <@t> ufl.edu; 
> histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu 
> Sent: Fri, March 19, 2010 9:21:38 AM 
> Subject: RE: [Histonet] mouse perfusion rate 
> 
> The vasculature will leak too much and the mouse will get bloated - 
> you'll 
> see it first in either the intestines blowing up like a balloon or
fluid 
> coming out of the nose. Just not the same as the heart pumping when
the 
> mouse is alive with intact physiology and normal functioning. Don't
know 
> exactly why, but that's what happens when you go too fast. Perhaps the
> vasculature has lost its control to compensate for the pressure? I'm
not 
> a 
> physiologist so I'm not sure why...maybe someone on the Histonet can 
> answer 
> that? 
> 
> Regards, 
> Merced 
> 
> --On Thursday, March 18, 2010 5:49 PM -0500 
> Charles.Scouten <@t> leica-microsystems.com wrote: 
> 
>> 
>> 
>> Why not? What happens? One would think the mammalian cardiovascular 
>> system could withstand physiological pressures and flow rates, at
least 
>> for one lifetime? 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Cordially, 
>> 
>> Charles W. Scouten, Ph.D 
>> 
>> Product Manager, MNL 
>> 
>> Biosystems Division 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Leica Biosystems Richmond, Inc. 
>> 5205 Route 12 
>> P.O. Box 528 
>> Richmond, IL 60071 
>> United States of America 
>> 
>> Telephone 630 964 0501 
>> 
>> facsimile +1 630 964 0576 
>> 
>> www.MyNeuroLab.com 
>> 
>> www.leica-microsystems.com 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> IMPORTANT - This email and any attachments may be confidential. Any 
>> retransmissions, dissemination or other use of 
>> 
>> these materials by persons or entities other than the intended
recipient 
>> is prohibited. If received in error, please contact 
>> 
>> us and delete all copies. Before opening or using attachments, check
them 
>> for viruses and defects. Our liability is limited 
>> 
>> to resupplying any affected attachments. [Any representations or
opinions 
>> expressed in this email are those of the 
>> 
>> individual sender]. 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> From: histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu 
>> [mailto:histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu] On Behalf Of
Merced M 
>> Leiker < leiker <@t> buffalo.edu> 
>> Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2010 12:38 PM 
>> To: MKing < making <@t> ufl.edu>; histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu 
>> Subject: Re: [Histonet] mouse perfusion rate 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> That may be mouse cardiac output, but I can assure you, from
experience, 
>> you do not want to perfuse at 17ml/min. 
>> 
>> Regards, 
>> Merced 
>> 
>> --On Thursday, March 18, 2010 1:32 PM -0400 MKing < making <@t> ufl.edu> 
>> wrote: 
>> 
>>> Li, 
>>> 
>>> Mouse cardiac output seems to be about 17 ml/min (e.g. 
>>> www.transonic.com/mice1.shtml), you probably want to try for that to
>>> keep pressures close to physiological. 
>>> A syringe pump is pretty inexpensive and probably all you need. 
>>> 
>>> Mike 
>>> 
>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>> From: Li Zhang < dancingwing <@t> yahoo.com> 
>>> Date: Wednesday, March 17, 2010 14:59 
>>> Subject: [Histonet] question about mouse perfusion 
>>> To: histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu 
>>> 
>>> > > My question is: can anyone give me a rough idea of how fast I 
>>> > > should inject ( like ml/min). I think I've tried like 30 ml in 3
>>> > > min, and I suspect that it's too fast because I do observe 
>>> > > tissue swelling sometimes. 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________ 
>>> Histonet mailing list 
>>> Histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu 
>>> http://lists.utsouthwestern.edu/mailman/listinfo/histonet 
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Merced M Leiker 
>> Research Technician III 
>> Cardiovascular Medicine 
>> 348 Biomedical Research Building 
>> State University of New York at Buffalo 
>> 3435 Main St, Buffalo, NY 14214 USA 
>> leiker <@t> buffalo.edu 
>> 716-829-6118 (Ph) 
>> 716-829-2665 (Fx) 
>> 
>> No trees were harmed in the sending of this email. 
>> However, many electrons were severely inconvenienced. 
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>> 
>> _______________________________________________ 
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> 
> 
> 
> Merced M Leiker 
> Research Technician III 
> Cardiovascular Medicine 
> 348 Biomedical Research Building 
> State University of New York at Buffalo 
> 3435 Main St, Buffalo, NY 14214 USA 
> leiker <@t> buffalo.edu 
> 716-829-6118 (Ph) 
> 716-829-2665 (Fx) 
> 
> No trees were harmed in the sending of this email. 
> However, many electrons were severely inconvenienced. 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________ 
> Histonet mailing list 
> Histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu 
> http://lists.utsouthwestern.edu/mailman/listinfo/histonet 
> 
> 

Merced M Leiker 
Research Technician III 
Cardiovascular Medicine 
348 Biomedical Research Building 
State University of New York at Buffalo 
3435 Main St, Buffalo, NY 14214 USA 
leiker <@t> buffalo.edu 
716-829-6118 (Ph) 
716-829-2665 (Fx) 

No trees were harmed in the sending of this email. 
However, many electrons were severely inconvenienced. 

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