[Histonet] RE: Histonet Digest, Vol 21, Issue 8
Orr, Rebecca
ROrr <@t> enh.org
Mon Aug 8 07:51:06 CDT 2005
Hello Everyone,
Does anyone out there run Pituitary panels on a fairly regular basis?
ACTH, LH, GH, FSH, PRL,and TSH...
Please respond privately if you wouldn't mind having a chat with me
about your experiences with them...specifically working with a single
control covering all of them...I am relatively new to day-to-day
clinical operations and I may be over-thinking this one...
Thanks again for your help.
Becky
Becky Orr, CLA HT (ASCP)
IHC Lead
Evanston Northwestern Healthcare
ph: 847-570-2771
-----Original Message-----
From: histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
[mailto:histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu] On Behalf Of
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Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2005 11:43 AM
To: histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
Subject: Histonet Digest, Vol 21, Issue 8
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Today's Topics:
1. tween detergens (Gudrun Lang)
2. stain (MARY JOHNSON)
3. RE: "Brit" Hitotech/Firestorm? (Charles.Embrey)
4. fixation via perfusion (Wisam Barkho)
5. Re: troubles with CD4 (Amos Brooks)
6. help: Heidanhein's azan trichrome (Sasha Manhattan)
7. RE: "Brit" Hitotech/Firestorm? (Rogerson Kemlo (ELHT) Pathology)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sat, 6 Aug 2005 19:56:35 +0200
From: "Gudrun Lang" <gu.lang <@t> gmx.at>
Subject: [Histonet] tween detergens
To: "Histonetliste \(Histonetliste\)"
<histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu>
Message-ID:
<mailman.0.1123434000.1935.histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi all,
We are going to run FISH on our ventana benchmark. In the last step we
have
to wash the slides to remove the liquid cover slip. Until now we use a
green
dish-washing product for the ihc, but that doesn't fit with the FISH
because
of autofluorescence.
Can anyone give me a hint, if Tween 20 in ?% solution in water is okay?
Or
any other well working detergens?
Our Ventana-Lady is also looking for a colourless dish-washer, but with
no
results yet.
Thank you in advance
Gudrun Lang
Linz, Austria
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Sat, 6 Aug 2005 11:16:28 -0700 (PDT)
From: MARY JOHNSON <beingmary53 <@t> sbcglobal.net>
Subject: [Histonet] stain
To: histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
Message-ID: <20050806181628.33904.qmail <@t> web81610.mail.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Hi Herbert, have you tried the Movat Pentachrome stain, if you need the
procedure sent me your email and I will sent you the procedure.
Mary
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Sat, 6 Aug 2005 13:55:20 -0500
From: "Charles.Embrey" <Charles.Embrey <@t> carle.com>
Subject: RE: [Histonet] "Brit" Hitotech/Firestorm?
To: "Terry Murphy" <lubbockcat <@t> hotmail.com>, <hawkmoon15 <@t> cox.net>,
<histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu>
Message-ID:
<C320919A1C432845938BCD8CC3294A30205EB1 <@t> EXCHANGEBE1.carle.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi Terry, Please know that some Pathologists' Assistants belong to this
list as well and I really don't like someone not in my shoes telling me
that I am overpaid. I spent 20 years in the Air Force and busted my
@#%@# as a Histotech and Histology Supervisor for less than underpaid
civilian histotechs make. But I really wasn't in the military for the
money. I finished my education and joined the AAPA, passing my
Fellowship exam after retiring from the Air Force. I am here at work on
a Saturday, after already putting in a 40 hour week so that I can finish
up some paperwork I couldn't complete during the week because of the
500+ cases I grossed and the two cancer conferences I needed to attend.
I do agree that histotechs are behind on the pay scale but don't let
your "sour grapes" cause you to spout off about a profession you don't
work in. Education doesn't always equate to salary. I personally know
some histotechs with only high school education that can work circles
around BS educated registered HTL's. They have a fully working
knowledge of histology theory, do a great job and have my full respect.
To me you sound like someone that "toots his own horn" a lot and
probably carries mini copies of your diplomas in you wallet. I am sorry
that you met an "arrogant PA" but we are not all like that. I am
normally a pretty easy going, laid back southern boy except when someone
spouts of generalizations that are untrue out of self pity over his own
situation.
Charles Embrey, HT, PA(ASCP)
Histology Manager
Carle Clinic Illinois
-----Original Message-----
From: histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
[mailto:histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu] On Behalf Of Terry
Murphy
Sent: Saturday, August 06, 2005 7:34 AM
To: hawkmoon15 <@t> cox.net; histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
Subject: Re: [Histonet] "Brit" Hitotech/Firestorm?
HI everyone
I feel the urge to join this discussion. I got into the field of
histology
15 years ago and enjoyed the work and the concepts. I wanted to move up
in
the field ao I earned my HTL (ASCP) instead of the HT(ASCP) since I have
a
Bachelor's degree in Biology. That didn't get me any more respect or
money.
Still trying to improve my situation I earn a Master's degree in
Health
Administration and I once again my employment has not improved. As a
matter
of fact my employment situation has gotten worse since I earned a
Master's
degree. I had acheived a position as a supervisor only to be "run out
of
the lab" by an arrogant PA and, I can only assume, seasoned histotechs
that
fear change.
Any way now I have been working as a traveling histotech. The pay is
better
than if I had a permanent job. The facility I am at now recently hired
a
person to be trained as a tech. This new employee has a GED not a high
school dipolma and he has no background in in science or medicine. He
is
doing good given his background but I find it kind of a insult to
educated
techs like myself that that someone without education or experience has
been
hired to do the same job that us techs have studied extensively.
Now I am done traveling and am trying to get a histotech job close to my
home town so I can live in my house and more importantly live with my
wife.
I have applied for tech positions and either haven't heard from the
facility
except for a rejection letter. When I can get a hold of a hireing
supervisor I have been told that "this is a entry level position and it
doesn't pay well", "you are overqualified", and, this really surprised
me,
"your skill set will not go well in our laboratory". Someone on this
board
mentioned about being "black listed" I feel that I have now entered that
list. Most likely I have more education than the people that I would be
reporting to and they probably feel threatened by me. Someone suggested
that I "dumb down" my resume and exclude some education and my
publication
but I do not like the idea of excluding accomplishments that I am proud
of.
Lastly, as for wages, histotechs are grossly underpaid while Pathologist
Assistants are grossly overpaid!!!!
Thanks for letting me vent. Sincerely,
Another fustrated histotech.
>From: "Sarah Jones" <hawkmoon15 <@t> cox.net>
>To: <histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu>
>Subject: Re: [Histonet] "Brit" Hitotech/Firestorm?
>Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 16:12:29 -0700
>
>I have to remind you here, Diana, that you are speaking for yourself
only
>with your statement about "in NA we tend to stay put". That may be for
>some
>people. However, I have found throughout my ~40 year career in
>Histotechnology (especially in the last half of it!!) the only way to
get a
>decent raise is to pack up and move on. Unfortunately, here in NA our
>annual raises do not even keep up with the cost of living. In fact, it
is
>down-right terrible!! I have my HTL and got my CM recently, I am proud
to
>say. However, I haven't received any additional compensation for
either,
>and I doubt I ever will. (HTL for 24 yrs.)
>
>Which brings up something else: The ASCP used to be the American
Society
>of
>Clinical Pathologists. It is now the American Society of Clinical
>Pathology. What changed? I'm not sure. Does anyone know, except the
>'insiders', that is? I do have first-hand knowledge of what used to
be.
>The Pathologists ran it, and they had a lot to do with where Histotechs
>sat -- low on the rung of the Pathology Laboratory ladder for YEARS.
The
>Registry was in my home town in Muncie, Indiana, and my Mother was the
>secretary to the Registrar for many years. (This was all before it was
>centralized in Chicago. Prior to the relocation to Chicago, the
Registry
>was in the town where the Chairman of the Board was located. L.
>Montgomery,
>M.D., was the Chairman of the Board for ~30 years that I know of, and
thus
>was the Registry located in Muncie.) There are other things I could
tell
>you; but I was sworn to secrecy years ago, and I will honor that
pledge.
>Suffice it to say, the Pathologists wanted to keep the salaries of the
>Histotechs down, and did everything in their power to do so. 'Nuff
said!
>
>When I started into the field of Histotechnology at the University of
>Chicago back in 1965, the Techies associated with the ASCP were trying
to
>change the requirements for Histotechs, but to no avail. Not until
January
>of 2005 did the change they were attempting to accomplish way back then
>prevail. I didn't really understand what was happening then, but
today I
>do. There are MANY places here in the USA (where there is a severe
>shortage
>of Histotechs) where they will still hire techs that are not licensed.
In
>fact, there are places where a licensed Histologic Technician OR a
licensed
>Histotechnologist are black-listed by the other techs--most likely in
fear
>that their own incompetence might be discovered!
>
>The cost of living in certain areas of the country are no longer taken
into
>consideration in the way they were in the past when it comes to hiring
>techs. That also saddens me. How is it that they think I can live in
the
>most expensive county in California that pays the lowest wages of any
>county
>in California?? That is craziness in my book!!!! Yet they wonder why
they
>cannot find good Histotechs here in this county! GO FIGURE!!
>
>Anyway, I could go on and on, but I won't. Hope this sheds some light
on
>some things for some folks. Please address any personal questions to:
>hawkmoon15 <@t> cox.net
>
>Sarah
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Diana McCaig" <dmccaig <@t> ckha.on.ca>
>To: <histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu>
>Sent: Friday, August 05, 2005 10:41 AM
>Subject: RE: [Histonet] "Brit" Hitotech/Firestorm?
>
>
> >
> > What are you all using to compare the wage scales. Biomedical
>scientists
>do
> > not get paid as well as we do in North America if you factor in
their
>cost
> > of living. I understand there is a recent trend to increase the
wages
>in
> > order to keep them on board as there is a lot of migration to
various
>labs
> > throughout a career where in NA we tend to stay put.
> > Diana McCaig, MLT
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Larry Woody [SMTP:slappycraw <@t> yahoo.com]
> > Sent: Friday, August 05, 2005 1:35 PM
> > To: mtitford <@t> aol.com; histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
> > Subject: Re: [Histonet] "Brit" Hitotech/Firestorm?
> >
> > You may want to try some of the big biotech companies where there is
> > a need for people with more skills in the lab and the compensation
can
>be
> > better than a medical lab.
> >
> > mtitford <@t> aol.com wrote:Rogerson Kemlo carries on the discussion
> > about histotechnologist training.
> >
> > In regards to hospital histology labs in the USA:
> >
> > I don't want to start a firestorm of criticism here, but I think
> > there is a real danger that in Great Britain those technologists
>performing
> > in the histology laboratories may be over qualified.A few months ago
>here
>on
> > the Histonet, someone in the U.K. was bemoaning the lack of
histology
> > technologists in the U.K., and how short staffed they were. Was that
>because
> > the bar had been set too high? Was the level of education required
too
>much
> > for the compensation received? Has a "closed shop" (to use a union
>term!)
>in
> > effect, been created?
> > Here in the United States there are hundreds of community type
> > hospitals and smaller medical centers that have histology
laboratories.
>In
> > those laboratories work histotechnologists doing a fine job with a
lot
>less
> > education than a fully qualified histotechnologist in the U.K.. At
the
>other
> > end of the spectrum are histology laboratories here doing more
advanced
> > procedures where degrees and extra training are required.
> > However, histotechnology training in the U.K. and USA are inherently
> > different. When I lived in the U.K. years and years ago (and it may
have
> > changed now), all the hospitals were government owned, lab personnel
got
>a
> > day off each week with pay to attend IMLT classes, and the classes
were
> > free. To work in a hospital laboratory you had to be "State
Registered".
> > In the USA hospitals are owned by all sorts of organizations. You
> > don't get "day release" to attend classes. If you do attend classes,
>money
> > has to come from somewhere to pay for it. Further you may live
>miles/hours
> > from the nearest college where you can attend classes.Since the
>different
> > organisations may be "for profit" or even "Non-profit", they want to
>save
> > money by not paying too higher salaries. Most often they pay what
other
> > hospitals in the area pay for the same type work.
> > The 50 states have different requirements for working in their
> > hospital laboratories.
> > Hospitals have coped with these differences by making histology
> > laboratories a separate section of the laboratory, with
> > technicians/technologists trained just to work in that lab.
> > I think a histotechnologist from the U.K. could easily find a
> > position in the USA, but they might feel underappreciated and
underpaid!
> > (maybe even under challanged!)
> > Well, that's my two bits worth!
> >
> > Mike Titford
> > USA Pathology
> > Mobile AL USA
> > _______________________________________________
> > Histonet mailing list
> > Histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
> > http://lists.utsouthwestern.edu/mailman/listinfo/histonet
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page
> > _______________________________________________
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> > http://lists.utsouthwestern.edu/mailman/listinfo/histonet
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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> > Histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
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>
>
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------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Sat, 6 Aug 2005 16:44:42 -0700
From: "Wisam Barkho" <daufoi <@t> msn.com>
Subject: [Histonet] fixation via perfusion
To: <histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu>
Message-ID: <BAY5-DAV20B260AE79D68711388377D5C60 <@t> phx.gbl>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hello,
We are doing stereotaxic surgeries on rats in my lab. After 2 weeks, we
fixate the brain via perfusion using 4% PFA (after vascular rinse) and
then
immerse the brains in 4% PFA overnight. My question is where can I find
information on pump flow rate and PFA volume to use during fixation?
Thanks.
Wisam Barkho
daufoi <@t> msn.com
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 22:34:31 -0400
From: Amos Brooks <amosbrooks <@t> earthlink.net>
Subject: [Histonet] Re: troubles with CD4
To: histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
Message-ID: <42F57337.3000605 <@t> earthlink.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Tom,
What is the pH of the retrieval solution that you are using? In
our experience CD4 tends to work best with a high pH retrieval solution
(like Dako's high pH retrieval solution or Biocare Medical's Borg
Decloaker).
We use Sigma's Impress for detection of this because of it being
a polymer which does not use avidin/ biotin it avoids the endogenous
biotin background that high pH retrieval tends to increase.
Just some suggestions to try,
Amos Brooks
Message: 15
Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 10:47:22 -0500
From: "Thomas Pier" <tp2 <@t> medicine.wisc.edu>
Subject: [Histonet] troubles with CD4
To: <histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu>
Message-ID: <s2f343c7.086 <@t> gwmail.medicine.wisc.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Hello all,
I was wondering if anyone could help me with some problems that I'm
having with staining for CD4. My control tissue for the work up is
formalin fixted, paraffin embeded tonsil. I'm using Labvision's CD4
Ab-2 clone 1F6. I have diluted it anywhere from 1:10-1:50. I'm using
1% goat serum in TBS as my diluent. I've tried EDTA HIER as recomended
on the data sheet. I've also tried protease XXV w/ or w/o the EDTA. I
shouldn't be running into the peroxidase problem since I'm using an
alkaline phosphatase detection system (Biocare's Vulcan Fast Red). I
have also tried using or not using a 10% goat serum protein block. I
have gotten some staining, but nowhere near as much as I should in a
tonsil. Any help that you could give me would be greatly appreciated.
Tom Pier
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 00:39:35 -0700 (PDT)
From: Sasha Manhattan <sasha_sashimi <@t> yahoo.com>
Subject: [Histonet] help: Heidanhein's azan trichrome
To: histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
Message-ID: <20050807073935.7707.qmail <@t> web31201.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Hello colleagues,
I am a student at the University of Hong Kong. I am trying
Heidanhein's azan staining to quantitate the extent of fibrosis in mouse
liver.
When I tried it for the first time, there was
a blue colour in the tissues showing collagen deposition, which is what
I
expected, but the protocol I used does not include aniline. I only
used 95%
alcohol to extract azaocarmine G from collagen because our lab do not
have aniline at the moment. but since i got the blue colour, i think
it
was ok. but now that I repeat it with the same tissue, i dont see any
blue colour. I thought maybe the distilled water rinse washed out the
water-soluble aniline blue, but i repeated without washing in distilled
water (just put in 95% alcohol and then absolute alcohol and then
xylene clear), but there's still no blue colour. Could you tell me
what
could be wrong?
This is my protocol:
1.deparaffination, hydration through alcohols.
2. Put slides into azocarmine G solution at 50 degrees celsius for 1
hour.
3. Rinse quickly with dH2O.
4. Place into 95% ethanol.
5. Place into 1% acetic acid in 95% ethanol.
6. Rinse briefly in dH2O.
7. Place into 5% phosphotungstic acid for 2 hrs.
8. Place into aniline blue-orange G solution for 2 hrs.
9. Rinse very quickly with dH2O, dehydrate with 95% and 100%
ethanol(just dip), 3 changes of xylene each of 3 minutes. mount.
I would be very grateful if you could just tell me what might have
gone wrong. There is no one for me to ask in the lab because no one
does histology here, and I am really nervous and frustrated.
Thank you very much for your time and attention.
Yours sincerely,
Mimi Kwun-nok Man
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Sat, 6 Aug 2005 09:01:17 +0100
From: "Rogerson Kemlo \(ELHT\) Pathology" <Kemlo.Rogerson <@t> elht.nhs.uk>
Subject: RE: [Histonet] "Brit" Hitotech/Firestorm?
To: <mtitford <@t> aol.com>, <histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu>
Message-ID:
<53A22BBB01D6184EBF7A4DC18A021E9E5AD4D2 <@t> elht-exch1.xelht.nhs.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Thank you for that; what you say is very interesting and I agree with a
lot of it. Interestingly, whether it's because it's Holiday time, no-one
from the UK has answered my implied question. Are we overqualified in
the UK to be 'HistoTechs'; even more contentious, what is the role of
the Medical Laboratory assistant (Higher or even Associate
Practitioner)? Are they US Histotechs in disguise? Do we (Biomedical
Scientists) therefore, not exist in the US, and why not?
Kemlo Rogerson MSc MIBiol CBiol CSci DMS FIBMS
-----Original Message-----
From: histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
[mailto:histonet-bounces <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu] On Behalf Of
mtitford <@t> aol.com
Sent: 05 August 2005 17:59
To: histonet <@t> lists.utsouthwestern.edu
Subject: [Histonet] "Brit" Hitotech/Firestorm?
Rogerson Kemlo carries on the discussion about histotechnologist
training.
In regards to hospital histology labs in the USA:
I don't want to start a firestorm of criticism here, but I think there
is a real danger that in Great Britain those technologists performing in
the histology laboratories may be over qualified.A few months ago here
on the Histonet, someone in the U.K. was bemoaning the lack of histology
technologists in the U.K., and how short staffed they were. Was that
because the bar had been set too high? Was the level of education
required too much for the compensation received? Has a "closed shop" (to
use a union term!) in effect, been created?
Here in the United States there are hundreds of community type hospitals
and smaller medical centers that have histology laboratories. In those
laboratories work histotechnologists doing a fine job with a lot less
education than a fully qualified histotechnologist in the U.K.. At the
other end of the spectrum are histology laboratories here doing more
advanced procedures where degrees and extra training are required.
However, histotechnology training in the U.K. and USA are inherently
different. When I lived in the U.K. years and years ago (and it may have
changed now), all the hospitals were government owned, lab personnel got
a day off each week with pay to attend IMLT classes, and the classes
were free. To work in a hospital laboratory you had to be "State
Registered".
In the USA hospitals are owned by all sorts of organizations. You don't
get "day release" to attend classes. If you do attend classes, money has
to come from somewhere to pay for it. Further you may live miles/hours
from the nearest college where you can attend classes.Since the
different organisations may be "for profit" or even "Non-profit", they
want to save money by not paying too higher salaries. Most often they
pay what other hospitals in the area pay for the same type work.
The 50 states have different requirements for working in their hospital
laboratories.
Hospitals have coped with these differences by making histology
laboratories a separate section of the laboratory, with
technicians/technologists trained just to work in that lab.
I think a histotechnologist from the U.K. could easily find a position
in the USA, but they might feel underappreciated and underpaid! (maybe
even under challanged!)
Well, that's my two bits worth!
Mike Titford
USA Pathology
Mobile AL USA
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Histonet mailing list
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http://lists.utsouthwestern.edu/mailman/listinfo/histonet
------------------------------
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